Why Trauma Informed Lawyering Matters | with Shannon Snedaker

In this episode, we sit down with Shannon Snedaker, founder and managing partner of Snedaker Law. Shannon shares her individual journey from defending insurance companies to becoming a passionate advocate for personal injury victims, heavily influenced by her personal experiences growing up with a brother who had a severe disability. We discuss the critical importance of lawyering that is trauma-informed, building legal referral networks, and prioritizing human connection over automation in client intake.

Timestamps

• •00:00:01 Journey into personal injury law
• •00:01:00 Early lessons in advocacy
• •00:04:16 Insurance companies to representing victims
• •00:05:51 Preparing them for testimony
• •00:12:21 Attorney referral networks
• •00:24:45 Empathy in client intake
• •00:36:31 Introducing The Trauma Attorney

Shannon: So, you know, and I can't speak for every personal injury attorney and their style, but my style is I am going to make sure I understand my client and then I'm going to build my strategy around that. I think a lot of attorneys want to jump into strategy and they want to dismiss maybe the irrelevant things or the tangents that, you know, clients go on that maybe aren't relevant to the claim, but it's relevant to that person. So if we know what their goals are, what their needs are, what justice looks like to them, then I can strategize around that to make sure that they are getting what they need and fulfilling their goals in a case. And so I always am addressing the person first and strategy second, but while I'm addressing the person, I'm keeping like the legal elements obviously and the strategy in mind as well.

Awais: My guest today is Shannon. She's the founder and managing partner of Snider Law, a personal injury firm in Lake Mary, Florida. She spent her early part of her career defending insurance companies before switching sides to represent injured people. So I really want to learn about her story, how she began with the injury law and how she has transitioned from the litigator to a defender. So Shannon, thank you for coming on my podcast today.

Shannon: Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here.

Awais: So Shannon, to be very honest, I want to know I did learn about your brother story. So I want to start there. I want to know how you got into this and just everything that's there that our audience wants to know.

Shannon: Okay. So yeah, I know you asked about you want to hear about my brother. So my brother he's actually older than me. So I was born into a family with a child who had a severe handicap from a complication before birth. So I have a very I guess unique perspective of how a traumatic incident can really affect more than just the person who's affected. It affects the whole family. So I kind of came into this world observing all the people around me and how my brother's issue impacted not only him and I mean obviously he was the most affected out of everybody. But obviously my parents and their relationship and then my sister and how she was affected by it. And then obviously, you know, I became a very strong advocate at an early age because my brother was bullied and so I'm 5 years younger and I'm arguing with people on the playground who are being mean to him because I'm not going to let somebody bully somebody else because of a handicap that they have. So I realized at a very young age that I am really good at advocating against the bullies and just it was innate in me and I guess it was because of the circumstances in which I was born into.

Awais: Right. So when somebody is going through this phase in life, it's obviously very difficult for the family and the person themselves. So what do you think how from the perspective of a person who's going through how do they feel when they're in this position and how important it is that their family should support them in such difficult times?

Shannon: Yeah. So like how would we support my brother in this? Is that what you mean?

Awais: Yeah.

Shannon: Yeah. So you know everybody processes issues differently and I think you know and I've learned throughout my career even not only my own personal relationship and dynamic in our family but just representing individuals who've been through trauma and the extended family members as well. Like everybody responds to situations differently. And so we really need to stop and listen and hear of those individuals because everybody has different needs and a different way that they need support. So sometimes support they someone will want you by their side every second of the day. Someone wants you advocating for them. Sometimes it's just you need someone who will listen to you. So support can look different dependent on the particular individual. And I think especially as an attorney and an advocate, we need to know what our clients or family member or whoever it is, we need to know what they need before we jump in and assume that we know what support looks like to them.

Awais: Right. And because you've been doing this work for a very long time and I learned that you were basically defending the insurance before. So what were you doing back then and why did you transition into defending the clients themselves?

Shannon: Yes. So I was working for all the big insurance companies defending personal injury claims and then you know switched sides quite some time ago where I'm representing individuals and clearly from me already explaining my background it made more sense for me my personality to be defending the individuals. But working for the insurance company and understanding what they think and how they process and what they need in order to process a claim is a huge benefit now to my clients because you have to know why the bully is acting the way they're acting in order to attack it. So now I know what the insurance company is looking at, what they need, how they think so I can be a one step ahead of them when I'm representing the individuals.

Awais: Now, that's a really good answer. And honestly, that's where my next question leads to. Basically, let's suppose there is a person injured, right? And now they're in trauma. So, when they are there, they might just switch stories or maybe the story is not in order. Sometimes they forget details, could go blank or freeze. So how do you handle that and what is the process of explaining to the clients that okay this is how you are going to answer all the questions which obviously the other side is asking?

Shannon: Right. So sitting down with a client and you know gaining trust with them or preparing them to articulate something that's really hard starts with the first meeting with the client. So, we have to recognize, we as attorneys have to recognize the signs that would suggest that a client is traumatized. I mean, we might assume they are from a particular incident or we might assume that they're not and they are. So our job is to filter through that and that starts in the first interaction with the client. And one thing that I've noticed is a lot of clients who are really traumatized that first meeting, they really can't stay on track at all. They're all over the place. You ask them a question, they're answering something completely different. So, taking note of that and letting them have their narrative and let them just talk and kind of follow down their rabbit holes in those first meetings because then each additional meeting, you can set the expectations of what they're going to what you're going to go over so they know what to expect. And then you can set like we're just going to handle these first couple of topics today in our meeting. We're going to have a short meeting and then if we need to we'll schedule a second one. So sometimes, you know, dependent on the severity of the trauma the particular client has experienced. I mean, I could have preparation sessions for testimony that are, you know, seven different times I'm meeting with them and I meet for 45 minutes at a time, max an hour, or maybe it's three times dependent on how traumatized they are. But you have to take note of the trauma they're experiencing and the signs of the trauma in those first encounters before you even think about prepping them for testimony.

Awais: Right. And this starts with when the person calls your firm or maybe they've filled a form, right? So how is your script way different than standard PI intake script?

Shannon: So like on intake, how is my script different?

Awais: Yeah.

Shannon: Yeah. So you know and I can't speak for every personal injury attorney and their style. But my style is I am going to make sure I understand my client and then I'm going to build my strategy around that. I think a lot of attorneys want to jump into strategy and they want to dismiss maybe the irrelevant things or the tangents that you know clients go on that maybe aren't relevant to the claim but it's relevant to that person. So if we know what their goals are, what their needs are, what justice looks like to them, then I can strategize around that to make sure that they are getting what they need and fulfilling their goals in a case. And so I always am addressing the person first and strategy second. But while I'm addressing the person, I'm keeping like the legal elements obviously and the strategy in mind as well.

Awais: Right. So I'm just you know trying to understand the whole process here because let's say there's a person who calls your firm right. Obviously it's a high velocity sort of injury is about a high velocity. So now either he's going to pick up he's going to somebody on your team who's a human is going to pick it up or maybe an AI agent that's going to pick it up, right?

Shannon: No AI.

Awais: Somebody

Shannon: No, no AI.

Awais: Oh, thank God. We are providing personal care. No AI because this is what I have experienced. We've worked with a very similar firm, not personal injury but family firm handling both AI was there and the human agents were there. But they had all this trouble where they couldn't actually put the blame who was losing the leads, right? So it was either their marketing team not generating enough qualified leads or whether it was their intake team including their intake AI whether it was not qualifying them enough to be you know somebody that can sign a retainer. So what how do you deal with this and when you don't have an AI what do you do about the after hours calls that you get?

Shannon: Yeah. So we definitely do not use AI. I mean my whole marketing strategy is being personal and treating the clients you know like a human and not a number and important regardless of size of case. So that's not something I ever considered and won't. So how do we handle like after hours? You know, a lot of our cases come in through referrals from other attorneys especially. So, if we get any information about a potential client or even if they call our office and leave a message or enter the chat on our website or the website form, someone is responding in real time on the weekend. So, and all of everyone in our office from an intake perspective, everybody knows how to do it. Everybody knows that it's very important to me in our firm that we are respecting the person and hearing them and validating them from the first phone call. So we will jump on any lead whether it's a holiday or a weekend. And our office is so amazing that everybody's ready to jump in and do that and we'll do that even if they're you know it's late at night or early in the morning or a weekend a holiday etc. So that is how we handle that.

Awais: Well, that's that's great because on referral I had this guest earlier and she was basically telling about referral marketing. So the question that I want to ask you for example somebody's listening a managing partner is listening right now they want to build this referral network and relationships because you are so dependent on that. Who do you target first? Is it the lawyers in the same practice area or is it lawyers in other practice areas or even not in legal industry at all?

Shannon: Yeah. So, all of it, right? I think my goal is to be top of mind everywhere with everybody all the time. So, you introduce yourself to someone in the public. You can't just be, oh, what do you do? Oh, I'm an attorney. No, I'm a personal injury attorney. Right, they got to know what you do. And probably the biggest referrals I get are other attorneys who practice outside of personal injury, like family law, bankruptcy, contracts, real estate, all of that. Because if they are providing the same level of care, say a family law attorney that I provide my personal injury clients, then their family law client is going to call them and say, "Hey, I was just in an accident. Who would you recommend?" because a family law attorney is that person's go-to, right? So then they'll refer to me. I mean, and just similarly, so I'll have clients who say, "Hey, I know, you know, you don't you help me with my car accident, but I'm going to get a divorce and I need a divorce attorney. Can you provide me a referral?" So, I'm trying to constantly have lunches, go to voluntary bar events, stay top-of-mind in the legal community about what I do, and that I'm going to be there personally for their clients when their client has a need for that.

Awais: So, have you considered that when you are building these relationships, obviously one cost is the time cost. You're going to the lunches, you're attending events, you're networking. Have you assigned a value to your time on what you're spending here?

Shannon: Oh, I mean I don't know if I even I think I don't even think about that. I just do it because I'm always not chasing more in a financial way, but I make sure that every minute of minute of my day is used for something productive toward my goal. And so I enjoy having colleagues. So if I never get a case from, you know, a bankruptcy attorney, but I now have a connection that could benefit my client, so that's providing value, right? Or it's one more person who knows who I am which is helping the big picture perspective of marketing because if someone's you know at a dinner with that bankruptcy attorney who's never sent me a case and they're like have you heard of Shannon Snedaker and he's like oh yeah I went to lunch with her right so it's just all of it is valuable and priceless at the same time so yeah.

Awais: That that is that is correct. But then you see in the same industry I have learned that you could actually ask for referrals against a payment, you could also get it for free. Do you support this practice where lawyers can have financial dealings between them when referring clients to their folks? So you're are you referring to like referral fees from attorneys?

Shannon: Yeah. So technically we do not have referral fees. So, under contract, here you have to, it's co-counsel. So, there's not necessarily a referral fee. It is if you're getting a fee of the case, you are considered co-counsel in the case. So, and I'm I mean that's the standard. So, that's what we do. And like I said, a lot of times the attorneys who are sending me cases or referring their clients to me, they're referring their clients or they're good friends. So, they have a relationship with them. And I make sure that it's known at the intake process that, you know, family law attorney sent you this case and I just need you to know that calling him is like calling me and we're one team. So, it's very clear to the client that they're not losing that family law contact even though I am taking the lead on the personal injury case.

Awais: Right. And this is basically where I want to ask this. Let's suppose there's a new attorney, right? and he or she really wants to build relationships, but they're just new. They don't have a bunch of clients. In fact, they're hungry for more cases.

Shannon: Yeah.

Awais: They How will they just walk up to you and ask for a referral when they can do nothing in return for you?

Shannon: Yeah. I mean, I think that building a relationship, you don't necessarily have to ask for the referral, right? So, and it's not tit for tat. It shouldn't be. Because, you know, I could get one family law referral in one year and 10 the next, right? You never know what you're going to get. Someone might not even get a personal injury referral. But, I think if you're out there and you're building relationships, you know, it will come. It will come. So, you just if you're a young attorney and you're just starting your own practice and you want to get business in the door, then you need to be outside in front of people and reminding them what you do and the reputation will come because then it'll be out there. People will know what you're doing. They see that you're in the community. And you know I tell some associates in my office like when you go to lunch with another attorney and you're trying to get business it's 90% the conversation is building a relationship 10% talking business. So just get to know these people and the work will come. It will come.

Awais: But when it comes to you know as you grow and scale your firm obviously it's very difficult for you to meet so many people right and there's workload but you also have to see which marketing because this is sort of a marketing channel as well when you putting yourself out there so how important it is for your firm specifically to get numbers involved when it comes to the ROI of each marketing channel?

Shannon: Oh my gosh. I just hope that the money I'm putting out is going to come back to me eventually. I try not to put too because it's overwhelming, right? And especially in personal injury, you know, you're hoping that the billboards, the commercials, the YouTube, the social media, all of that is hopefully putting you on the short list in someone's mind when they get in an accident, right? Because you don't know when it's going to happen. So you just want to be always out there. And some, in my opinion, marketing tools are more of a reinforcer than, you know, a frontline marketing tool. So like billboards for example, I don't think you're ever going to see an ROI on, but it is a good reinforcer if you're advertising or marketing elsewhere like, oh, I've seen her there. So I just really try to be as in many places as I can to remain top of mind and fingers and toes crossed that it comes in.

Awais: No, I completely understand that because I asked this question because there's a very good friend of mine Eric Hoffman. He came to my podcast and he told me that he got like five clients signed up from my podcast on his AI receptionist legal tech tool he's building. And I was pretty surprised because that podcast doesn't have a lot of views, right? And he came back to my podcast. We had another interview and he's such a nice guy. But then the only way he got to know is because we attached his tracking tools within the links people could go and see what he's doing. But the thing is that a lot of attorneys don't do this right. So they don't know let's suppose I am building my Tik Tok channel for very very long and after like two years I learned that I'm not getting any clients but maybe from few videos that I posted on YouTube, I got like couple of clients from there. So, is it justified that we keep on putting videos on Tik Tok or emphasizing on that channel when it's not even working for us rather than just not working on other channels which do work. So do you think data is important in that sense or should we just

Shannon: Yeah, I mean I don't think you should blindly just throw money at things, right? Maybe at first you do and then you have to always fine-tune it. So we're always looking at okay, you know, is the intake coming from commercials? If it's not, you know, is it something wrong with the commercial itself? Is it where it's positioned in the rotation for TV? Same thing with social media. Are we getting activity from the authoritative reels or the funny reels or not at all? So I think it's important to have data, but I also think it is very challenging for us as attorneys to always know exactly where people are finding us because everybody will say Google because everybody's going to Google to find the contact number. And a lot of times when they're calling us, they're in crisis mode, right? So, our job first is to calm them down. Second is to sign them up and then yes, if they're in a position where we can ask them, how did you find us? And then they say, oh, it was a commercial. Okay. Well, do you mind telling us which station and which show and what time? I mean, clients don't have the patience for that all the time and understandably so because they just got involved in an accident or they're getting a divorce or something happened with their child or they've been arrested whatever it is across all areas of practice. So I think data is important, but I also think that the nature of our business is really hard to track that.

Awais: Yeah. Exactly. And obviously data tells you a lot of things, but obviously in a crisis situation you just can't ask the person where did you find and probably if they do tell you probably it's not the truth. So that's the biggest issue. Google. It's always Google.

Shannon: Yeah.

Awais: So Shannon I wanted to know because you see you might have a great intake. You might have reminded the person they might have filled your intake form or whatever you do and then they decide okay we're going to show up on your consultation and then when you're sitting you have taken some time out and there is no show right so and that happens a lot of times does it happen to you and how do you fix that where the clients don't show?

Shannon: Not really. So sometimes we'll get a lead and we call and then they just don't call us back, which can happen. But most of the time if we get a hold of the client, I would say 98% of the time we're signing them up. We rarely get no shows. And I think that's in large part due to the market that my particular services speak to and our firm services. Like we're marketing to people who really need help versus the people who want the quick check. So I think quick check people tend to no show and are a little bit more flighty at times, but people who really need help, they're going to be ready to meet with you because they're in a place of not desperation, but you know, they have an urgency that they really want to be in front of an attorney and talk to them about their case.

Awais: Well, the number you've given me, 98%, is a very very promising number, honestly. And a lot of people don't get that. And is it because your first step is that there's a human involved. They have a proper protocols that they follow and that's how they qualify the person enough that they feel like yes we want to book the call with them and we have to talk to them?

Shannon: Yes. I mean staff, my our staff, we have a great great great amazing team. And every single person that works in our office has some experience in customer service. And I'm a firm believer that if you can talk to someone on the phone and make them feel comfortable, make them feel heard, I can teach you the rest, right? I can teach you the law. I can teach you how to be a paralegal. I can teach you how to be a legal assistant. I can teach you all of that. I can't teach you how to be kind and I can't teach you how to listen. So if you have that innate ability already, then the rest is plug and chug. So we have amazing staff that just really know how to hear and validate the individuals in a time when they need that the most. And so that's why I think we see a good return on people signing up because that's what the clients are getting the first call they make and they're not being pushed to a call center or to someone who doesn't know what they're doing or someone who is more concerned about the work on their desk than the person on the phone.

Awais: Yeah, that I think that's the most important thing and human element should never ever ever be eradicated from customer facing jobs. This is very very important. But right in today's time everybody's pushing AI. Well we are Lawmatics affiliate partners so they're going to kill me on this, but what I'm going to tell you is

Shannon: [laughter]

Awais: but I still believe that there are certain processes which take up a lot of your time and that can be automated. So have you applied certain processes? What kind of maybe not take the names of the software it's all right, but which processes have you automated and what are the results? Are you seeing any benefits from that or not?

Shannon: Yeah. I mean look AI is here. I don't want it to take over, but I think that there are some time-saving tools that AI provides. So we definitely implement you know not for legal writing, but just to get like ideas for things like maybe there's a better way to word something. I've used AI to like filter through if we have a really big negligent security case where there's a bunch of public records plugging in the public records into an AI system so they can give me a summary of where the calls were and things of that. That's like a huge timesaver where that would take a human a lot of time and bandwidth to be able to sift through if you have 600 different police reports over a year span. So I think it is really good for maybe that first filter step, but I still think it's really important that human eyes are put on documents and put on the process to make sure that it is legally correct, ethically correct and AI isn't perfect. So we got to make sure we need to make sure that it's okay. I mean, and then also we've used AI with some of the social media things, you know, just to have a little bit of fun if it's like a Halloween post or things like that that just you got to stay relevant. But I don't want to lean too much into AI because like you said, we are customer service and I want to make sure I talked to a whole thing for the my bank today that was AI and it was I mean, you could tell it was AI, but it was a really good AI. It sounded like a real person, but I know it's not. I'm like, just get me to someone. I want a human. I don't want to talk to you AI. I want to talk to a human who I can actually have a real conversation with. So I am a big believer in having that human interaction.

Awais: Yeah. And honestly, it's just digressing. I'm just digressing on this, but I was actually testing this out and a lot of AI voice agents these days, even if you put them really put really good guardrails around them and if you ask them mid conversation, can you tell me a joke? They'd actually stop there and start telling a joke. And sometime that's the best way to catch them if somebody doesn't know that it's an AI or human. But in this process, right, I hope we know. I mean, they're good, but they're not that good.

Shannon: [laughter]

Awais: Yeah. So well, jokes aside, I just want to come back to the point and that is when you are implementing certain systems. So it is very important for a managing partner to decide when they should be hiring, firing or retaining certain tools or humans right themselves.

Shannon: Mhm.

Awais: So what is the decision making around that for you look like and if you could tell me if you are a big believer of retaining people and training them and rather than just people who are already trained get their ROI if they're not putting any ROI just let them go?

Shannon: Right. So as far as having like the right number of staff based on like the volume, I mean I'm a big believer if you're managing partner, you got to be present in your office as much as you can. I know we're pulled in different directions, but you got to have a pulse on your staff. Like are they overwhelmed, underwhelmed, how are they doing? Are they being productive? Are they not? And also like just knowing that you're there for them is important. So I am always checking in all the time with everybody in the office like where are you at? How's your case load? I'm feeling overwhelmed. Where how are you feeling? What's on your plate? This is taking you a long time. So, again, having that open communication with everybody in the office to see where they are before we make any hiring decision as far as adding another person. As far as utilizing outside tools to help make things more efficient, we do that, too. You can tell I'm the human person and my law partner is the techie person. So, he's always trying to come up with like the forms and the process and and making sure, okay, there's a way to generate a great form where everybody just uses that. So, you have to have both. You have to have good process and also be checking in with your staff all the time because if you have an idea of how they're doing, you're going to know when it's time to hire someone or not.

Awais: Right. So, that's a very very good answer. It basically completes that. I wanted to Shannon, I believe that the way you're explaining things, there could be 10 more episodes, but there's something that I have in mind that I want to discuss with you for a full episode if you give me another chance to invite you again.

Shannon: Sure.

Awais: The thing is that I've been actually researching on how law firms are going to survive this AI age. Just want to ask you this question. Does your law firm bill on time or do they have a standardized flat fee rates?

Shannon: So, we are contingency fee. So, we're contingent on the recovery. But with that being said, we do not input our time, but we input our activity. So we can, you know, see I can pick up a file like a my virtual file and log into our software and I can see what everybody in the office has worked on today and what they've touched and what if they talk to a client what they said. So we are definitely tracking activity. But we're not a billable firm, thank God, because that's terrible and I've done that when I defended the insurance claims and no thank you. I don't want to do that anymore.

Awais: And because the reason is because you see since AI is here it's very it's in the gray area where how much you can put as your billable time and then whether the law firms which are still following that model are going to be profitable or not because it seems like the clients are being favored highly because of you know AI now getting the work done pretty quickly. So on that we might have another discussion because it's a whole big topic for a lot of law firms, but do you have something else in mind that I haven't asked you and you want to share something about your law firm or specific thing you're working that might help my audience tremendously?

Shannon: Yeah. I mean, I guess I would like if someone is interested in starting a firm, I mean, I could talk about that forever in marketing. But just put yourself out there. I think a lot of people, you know, you can be a good lawyer, but not everybody that's a good attorney is a good manager or a good marketer. And leaning into other business owners is really important because we're we all can't be great at everything, you know, like I'm not the process person, my partner is. So I lean into him for that and he doesn't want to go to any marketing event. So he leans into me for that. And so similarly like you have to lean into the other business owners because we have to support each other of what works and what doesn't. And instead of staying at your desk behind your computer, like get out and meet people and network. And you'd be shocked how many things come your way, you know, like I've gotten cases that I never would have dreamed that would have come my way if I hadn't put myself out there. And you know, for example, we do a lot of human trafficking work and that was not something that was all on my radar probably five years ago and now I mean it's a good chunk of my practice and I love it and it's perfect cuz for me it suits my personality with the trauma stuff. But I would not have fall into that if I didn't put myself out from a marketing perspective and just tried, trusted that what I'm doing is okay and it's going to come and not expect immediate return. And I think that's a really hard thing. People expect an immediate return and I'm very impatient. So, I want everything yesterday. But I've learned that you need a slow growth, not a fast growth.

Awais: Yeah. And that's important because the best clients come through slow growth I think.

Shannon: Yes.

Awais: Yes. And and and this basically also I just noticed that I didn't notice that I'm really sorry that there is you have a podcast. I now read it. So tell me about that. So what is the purpose of that podcast? And like you said, you have to put yourself out there. This is what you're doing right now with me. So why is it important and why did you start this podcast and what do you talk about on that podcast?

Shannon: Yeah, so we are starting that now it's new. That's my next venture if you will. And you know when I say put yourself out there like sometimes it's got to be stuff that you just believe in cuz then it's easy to do. So at least if you're not getting anything from it, you enjoy doing it. So it's fun. But yeah, so I have a side consulting business called the trauma attorney. So I help train, educate, I lecture about this about how attorneys need to be trauma informed in dealing with our clients and how you do that and how you recognize signs of trauma. So the podcast is driven towards that. So, recognizing signs of trauma, having mental health people come in, talking about cases that where there's been a trauma element, for example, the Diddy trial. I don't know if you watched that documentary where the you know Diddy was found not guilty on most of the charges and they were interviewing the jurors and the jurors found the women not credible which to me says they were traumatized and they couldn't articulate the trauma in an effective way. So the jurors evaluated them as being not credible and that's why they found for Diddy. So, my podcast is geared towards educating and recognizing the different elements of trauma and how that intertwines with the law practice and the legal field. Like the Lindsey Clancy trial is like a prime example. I mean, I think a lot of people love Kevin Readington because what they're seeing is him being trauma informed as he's defending his client. So, that's great.

Awais: Yeah, that's great. And I think it's a great subject to inform people about and I believe everybody who's listening into the same industry they should always check her podcast out. We will put the link down in the description so you can obviously see and I will be your few first followers because I really want to learn about this particular aspect of law and to be very honest I did not know about this particular niche that you talk about and it would be great help for me as well from learning from the best out there. So thank you Shannon for joining in today. I love talking to you. I hope that I've asked the right questions and you might not be feeling like, okay, this guy, yeah, this is great. It's fun. The conversation is always good. Sorry if I ramble sometimes.

Shannon: No, no, I mumble all the time. So, if you check my LinkedIn profile, I've just put the headline there that I mumble. So, if you're coming to my podcast, be very aware of that.

Awais: Now, you're perfect. Yeah. Thank you, Shannon, for coming today. Thank you. I appreciate.

About the Guest

Shannon Snedaker is the founder and managing partner of Snedaker Law, a personal injury firm located in Lake Mary, Florida. Having spent the early years of her career defending major insurance companies, she uses that knowledge now to fight for injured individuals and victims of trauma. She is also the creator of The Trauma Attorney, where she educates legal professionals on trauma informed practices.

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